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RE: 2004 Monaco Knight radiator
Mark.....Once a year when I do my servicing, I clean the radiator and use one of those long finger tools with the three fingers that pop out when you push the plunger. I use it to pull all of the debris out of the two corners at the bottom of the shroud from inside the coach. I meant to cut a notch into the two corners so stuff would fall out, but forgot.
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Diplomat Don
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05/24/12 12:50am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Mountain driving
Cleaning CAC and Radiator (from an article I wrote several years ago for Caterpillar, but most applies to all DP's):
By its very design, rear radiator rigs clog up the cooling system fairly quickly. Picture the amount of dirt stirred up from the road/shoulder by a 40' coach with its 6 tires driving at highway speeds. Pass that dirt-ladened air over the hot (and sometimes oily) rear axle, transmission and engine BEFORE it is sucked up by the cooling fan and forced through the after-cooler and then the radiator. THEY WILL CLOG UP. Certainly, dusty environments accelerate this. But at a minimum, all rear radiator coaches need their after-cooler cleaned once a year.
Most rear radiator coaches have a SANDWICHED cooling system with AFTER-COOLER first in line (closest to the engine) with the RADIATOR BEHIND it (toward the back). Note: after-cooler, inter-cooler and CAC are all the same thing, an air to air radiator between turbo and intake manifold. There are a very few coaches with STACKED after-cooler and radiator.
The vast majority of the dirt will be on the FRONT (front of coach) side of the forward most component which is the AFTER-COOLER-- cooling air flows from front to back. Access the top of the engine from bedroom/closet. Shine a strong flashlight inside the fan shroud/between fan blades. The fan blades "sling" the dirt toward the perimeter, so verify that the perimeter is as clean as the center. Ya, I know it is easier to see the center, but the fan blades "sling" the dirt to the perimeter. If it is just dirt, a hose and regular nozzle is all you need. If greasy or oily, use Joy liquid (dish washing detergent) in a spray bottle. Be SURE to rinse it off completely. You need to insure that the perimeter is as clean as the center.
While you are getting dirty, check the water pump belt (3116, 3126 and some C7's) for tension (small belt that only drives water pump) as well as serpentine belt that drives all accessories including fan).
And it may be time (3 years unless you have switched to Cat ELC) to change engine coolant and per Caterpillar, the thermostat(s) should be replaced every three years. With a sandwiched cooling system there is NO WAY to clean the front of the after-cooler effectively from the back (though it should also be done when cleaning). Water pressure sufficient to go through the radiator, air gap, and after-cooler with enough force to knock off dirt and grime from the front of the after-cooler would most certainly bend the radiator fins.
ALL diesels (Caterpillar, Cummins, etc) built prior to 1/1/07 vented the crankcase to atmosphere. If this vent is in front of the intake for air going to the cooling system, you are putting oily vapor as well as dirt into the front of the after-cooler. For less than $12, the "blow-by tube can be extended to behind the fan shroud intake which eliminates this as a source of cooling system contamination. Also verify that the extension ONLY goes downhill from the engine (no dip loop or sag) or you could do serious engine damage in cold weather. One of the byproducts of combustion is water vapor which can freeze if allowed to collect in the extension and if it blocked the whole tube BAD NEWS.
Also, make sure that you are not over-filling the engine oil, as excess oil is “puked” out the crankcase breather. For correct capacities on a Caterpillar engine, go to: http://www.catrvclub.org/forum/index.php/topic,6619.0.html or call the Caterpillar RV Hotline with your engine serial number at 877 777-3126.
Brett
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wolfe10
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05/10/12 04:18pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Mountain driving
Actually, radiator life is a LOT longer if coolant is changes as it should be, only distilled water and coolant used AND core kept clean.
"Core kept clean" on a DP means cleaning the FRONT of the CAC annually!
and how exactly is that done,(cleaning the front of the cac annually) if you don't mind.
Keeping the front of the radiator clean and free of debris, dirt and road grime equates to efficient transfer of heat. This is complicated with the CAC (Charge Air Cooler) due to its placement in front of the radiator. Cleaning regularly is much more beneficial than neglecting it and then trying to clean it once every several years. I generally pull my side grill and flush three to four times per year. Mine is also a side radiator which is a little more forgiving than a rear radiator in that respect. For a rear radiator I would strongly recommend at least once a year minimum. Personally I would clean more frequently but once a year minimum.
Mike.
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zmotorsports
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05/10/12 08:45am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Mountain driving
Actually, radiator life is a LOT longer if coolant is changes as it should be, only distilled water and coolant used AND core kept clean.
"Core kept clean" on a DP means cleaning the FRONT of the CAC annually!
and how exactly is that done,(cleaning the front of the cac annually) if you don't mind.
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Klueck
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05/10/12 07:25am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Mountain driving
Actually, radiator life is a LOT longer if coolant is changes as it should be, only distilled water and coolant used AND core kept clean.
"Core kept clean" on a DP means cleaning the FRONT of the CAC annually!
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wolfe10
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05/09/12 04:54pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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Mountain driving
This topic comes up fairly regularly, so I thought I'd share my experiences this past winter and spring driving from Alberta to Arizona with a 300 HP Cat DP.
While driving south last fall, all went well until we reached the high plains south of Salt Lake City, where the elevation is high and so is the speed limit. I put my foot down and kept pace with other traffic, actually passing some vehicles on the climbs up the long mountain pulls. Transmission stayed in 6th all the way up. As the ambient temperature rise, so did the engine temperature, and twice we had to pull over to let the motor cool down.
I took the motorhome to Freightliner in Chandler and asked them to clean the radiator fins and shroud, change the coolant and thermostats, and extend the slobber tube. This they did as well as regular maintenance service. They called and said there was a significant temperature differential between the top of the rad and the bottom and they recommended a rod and core as there appeared to be a restriction inside the rad. They cleaned the CAC and the rad while they were disassembled and buttoned everything up.
Driving back to Alberta last week was a different story altogether. Coupled with the service work and a complete change in my driving habits, we a stress- and trouble-free journey. I set the cruise control to sixty miles per hour and let the Allison transmission do the downshifting as necessary. I tried to keep the RPMs at about 1750, and as such experienced a MUCH better fuel economy as well. We got about 9 MPG going south, and 12 MPG coming north.
I have to thank many on this forum for sharing their experiences and insights, and I hope this little story will help some other new DP owner to be a little more confident in the mountains.
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BIGGDOGG
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05/09/12 03:03pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Georgie-Boy StANDard equipment
John that is a mute factor after age 10+.
We have a 1993 entry level Pursuit (first year for that model). I think the model you are looking at had more features but think the basic house were built the same perhaps.
The 1991 price range would run $5K - $10K on average I expect. It should not have the Auto Park parking brake system so that is a plus due to the fact they were someone complex compared to a manual parking brake pedal.
We gave $8K for our 1993 GBM Pursuit in 2007 and it had been used every season with the last trip two months before we bought it and was wet when we purchased it in July.
Thankfully ours is built on a 1992 Chevy P30 with a very powerful (per our shop when comparing it to other 454's) and came with 91K miles on it and now has 109K and just completed a 8K cross country late last fall in 31 days driving posted interstate speeds.
Expect to spend up to $5K on it after you get it over the next few years if you plan to put it over the road. Ours came with a new transmission (17K mile/5 years) the PO had installed. We had to redo the exhaust manifolds and rebuild the alternator and I told the shop I wanted a new water pump with all new belts and hoses.
When they pulled the radiator to save labor/do a better job we found the radiator had a couple weeps that fixed and tested OK. After the radiator shop learned it was going back into a MH going cross country they shook thier head that the old radiator would fail soon if ran hour after hour and offered to wave repair/testing bill and recore for $450 in 2007 so we jumped on the chance to have a 2007 cooling system in a 1992 chassis.
We have replaced the tires at age 10, put a new cooling unit in the frig, got the roof leak proof, covered from end to end with Web Seal Eternabond then coated with Liquid Rubber.
We put helper springs on the sagging rear and new coil springs on the front when the front air bags failed so air bags are no longer needed.
It came with Steer Safe system and we replaced front and rear sway bar bushings. Before the trip last fall I had the shop replace all rubber brake lines and flush the system as well as to drain, clean put synthetic lube in the rear end. We did the transmission bucket flush for the second time using Dexron VI since it had been 5 years since we did it the first time.
Hopefully we have many years with little repair required but one can never know when a machine will fail.
OK after all that and the fact we are happy with our GBM I strongly suggest you look at MH's not over 10-12 years old for many reasons.
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Gale Hawkins
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05/06/12 01:59pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Diesel started using oil
My friend (& fellow 2004 330 owner) says my 4 qt/11,000 mi oil consumption is too high. Yesterday, I removed the "breather" & found it totally clean. Breather tube extended out the back 4 years ago (per advice of Cat Service Manager) alleviated radiator core clogging. 7.5 mpg @ 60mph.
Don't know you friends level of knowledge, but you might give the Caterpillar RV Engine Hotline a call with your question. Have your engine serial number handy: 877 777-3126.
Assume your engine oil dipstick is calibrated and you are not adding oil until it at the "real" add mark.
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wolfe10
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04/29/12 07:29am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Diesel started using oil
My friend (& fellow 2004 330 owner) says my 4 qt/11,000 mi oil consumption is too high. Yesterday, I removed the "breather" & found it totally clean. Breather tube extended out the back 4 years ago (per advice of Cat Service Manager) alleviated radiator core clogging. 7.5 mpg @ 60mph.
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RH factor
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04/29/12 06:42am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Older Class A Updates
How have you checked the fridge?? sitting that long my have settled the ammonia, drive it on a rough road, then plug it in for the A/C then try it on the propane. Whether you keep the old fridge or not, replace it with a gas/elect, you may not think you are going to boon dock with it, but I bet you will. You can also take it out, turn it upside down and "burp it" .
Keep your propane system, you probably have a 20 gal system, two 5 gal tanks won't last very long and I doubt you have room for two 10's.
You have exactly what I have , a 454 on a p 30, no, do not pull the 454, the 350 will not give you better mileage as you will be working it harder and it won't last as long. I have modified mine, here in Idaho we don't have vehicle inspections ( north Idaho ) the first thing I did was to replace the exhaust manifolds with a set of Thorly headers and 3 inch exhaust pipes with Flow max mufflers 40 series, loud but nice, this also removed the air pump, cutting down on the amount of belts and pull on the motor...... The next thing I did was to cut the front of the air cleaner intake tube and slip a flex pipe off a new truck, I ran the snout out in front of the radiator so that it pulls cool air. I then went to a MSD ignition and gaped the plugs to 60. I then removed the truck air conditioner, pump, condenser and all. I can now pull any hill in any temp and it does not over heat. We run the gen while going down the road and use the house air conditioners, keeps the coach a lot cooler and no drag on the motor.
You do not want to remove the tag axle, it is there for a reason. You can carry more weight, most people over load their coaches, me included, that third axle lets you carry more weight and you like that Cadillac ride, don't pull it.
Yes a 6000 will meet your needs, but why, why spend more money on that, you are better off to spend it where you need it, don't replace something that is not broke. believe me you will spend enough money replacing stuff.
OK ,tires, not knowing just how old they are, I would replace them, there goes 1,500.00 dollars, replace all belts and hoses, not fun to do along side the road ( ask me ) check all seals, pan gasket and trans gasket, rear differential, filters, oil and fuel, if it doesn't have it use a water separator filter.
Clean it up, and use it, then change what you don't like. Mine gets 10 to 12 mpg, more with a tail wind, has been across country 3 or 4 times, and we love it. the wife wants a slide and I don't..........
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grousehunter 61
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04/05/12 05:02pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Older Class A Updates
Keep your propane system since you need it for heat, hot water and cooking. Just clean and repaint mounted on board tank, they do not need inspections. Check all your propane connection with soap for leaks.
The 454 was a very good engine we put 80,000 on our last one and mileage will be between 7-8 MPG at about 55 MPH and will increase slightly with tail wind. The exhaust manifolds are most like cracked so a good set of headers will help on the power end. Have radiator cleaned and checked if you haven't yet.
The fridge is up to you if you plan on dry camping replace with same. If your going with camp grounds with power converter to residential fridge.
If the generator runs good and is good condition I'd keep it in a minute. Those old Kohler are hard to beat, I don't think there's anything today that will out run or out last them beasts.
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past-MIdirector
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04/05/12 11:58am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: 2011 Monaco 43 VS 2011 Newmar 43
These are both great motor homes. No matter which one you choose you will be getting a great coach.
I have aqua hot. I do not see the big benefit over my previous class A with a central propane heater. Aqua hot is complex, noisy, and costs a lot to maintain. I do agree that a side radiator is much easier to clean.
we have not owned a Aqua but know many rv MH owners that have it. It does require alot of money to keep it working.
chevman
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larry barnhart
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04/01/12 11:07am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: 2011 Monaco 43 VS 2011 Newmar 43
These are both great motor homes. No matter which one you choose you will be getting a great coach.
I have aqua hot. I do not see the big benefit over my previous class A with a central propane heater. Aqua hot is complex, noisy, and costs a lot to maintain. I do agree that a side radiator is much easier to clean.
I have a aqua hot and find I use the 120V part of it 80% of the time.When the odd time i cut the diesel in it was not noisy.the units made before around 2006 were bad bad noisy and stinky
I have had mine for 18 months and so far i installed a new 7$ fuel filter.Like I say use thw 120V as much as possible
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rvrepairnut
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03/31/12 09:11pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: 2011 Monaco 43 VS 2011 Newmar 43
These are both great motor homes. No matter which one you choose you will be getting a great coach.
I have aqua hot. I do not see the big benefit over my previous class A with a central propane heater. Aqua hot is complex, noisy, and costs a lot to maintain. I do agree that a side radiator is much easier to clean.
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RFCN2
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03/31/12 09:05pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: 2011 Monaco 43 VS 2011 Newmar 43
@Gordonls do you see an advantage to the side radiator vs the rear? We go through the desert southwest all the time and I dont know how air flow is effected?
everyone knows full well the side RAD far superior but is more exspensive to buy compared to a rear rad.Better cooling,rad does not
plug near as quick or bad,easier to clean.The big one is engine accesabilty.Rear rad= none side rad = full access
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rvrepairnut
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03/31/12 09:39am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Pls Help! 09 American Allegiance 40x to buy or not to buy?
Hello All,
Went to the Good Sam Rally in Phoenix yesterday, Sat. Looked at a lot of coaches. I live in the Phoenix area. Great Rally, our first.
We got a pretty good deal on a 09 American Allegiance 40X. Hydro hot, side radiator, 16K miles, very clean. They will replace the tires and all of the batteries. It really purrrrrrrs when it is idleing. Test drove it and it felt really tight. The price is $175K.
This our first coach, getting ready to retire in a year and want to travel. I can not find very much info on this unit.
Is this a good coach? Is the price fair?
We have been looking for 3 years at coaches. We like the floor plan. We will sign the papers on Tuesday. Is this a safe coach to buy????
Thanks for any Help to can give me.
Les
this one is a better deal http://www.rvt.com/rvdetail4723421.htm
43 with tag and fully fully loaded 17K miles
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rvrepairnut
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03/25/12 10:10pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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Pls Help! 09 American Allegiance 40x to buy or not to buy?
Hello All,
Went to the Good Sam Rally in Phoenix yesterday, Sat. Looked at a lot of coaches. I live in the Phoenix area. Great Rally, our first.
We got a pretty good deal on a 09 American Allegiance 40X. Hydro hot, side radiator, 16K miles, very clean. They will replace the tires and all of the batteries. It really purrrrrrrs when it is idleing. Test drove it and it felt really tight. The price is $175K.
This our first coach, getting ready to retire in a year and want to travel. I can not find very much info on this unit.
Is this a good coach? Is the price fair?
We have been looking for 3 years at coaches. We like the floor plan. We will sign the papers on Tuesday. Is this a safe coach to buy????
Thanks for any Help to can give me.
Les
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goldviper
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03/25/12 05:19am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Shifting The Allison Manually In The Mountains
Basic operation. You may have also read the article in this month's FMCA Magazine/e-magazine on Allison Mode Button. Covers a lot of the same ground.
Use the "down" and "up" arrows with impunity. You can't mess it up. Said another way, if you down arrow 5 times at 60 MPH, nothing bad will happen-- it will just downshift one gear at a time until the selected gear is reached, but never such that the engine will over-speed.
Same applies to the "Mode Button"-- turn it from power to economy as often as you like while stopped or while driving.
For best manual control (more driver control but more driver input needed) in mountains, leave it in economy mode and use the down/up arrows. That allows you to downshift when you want/need AND also be able to lug down to peak torque RPM for better economy when you want.
Also, the transmission by definition is REACTIVE-- making decisions based on what happened well BEHIND YOU (because of vehicle momentum).
You, the driver can be PROACTIVE, anticipating what is happening IN FRONT of you.
And, as pointed out by the OP, manual selection can also keep the transmission from "hunting" between gears.
And, while I absolutely agree that raising RPM and lowering throttle setting will run cooler, except in extreme conditions, this should be viewed as a temporary solution and indication that, particularly on a rear radiator DP that the FRONT, repeat FRONT of the CAC be cleaned. You can NOT clean a sandwiched rear radiator cooling system (Charge Air Cooler in front of the Radiator) from the back only. The vast majority of the dirt will be on the front of the CAC and can only be effectively cleaned by accessing the engine from above and working inside the fan shroud/between fan blades.
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wolfe10
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03/11/12 09:45am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: expansion tank on radiator
I would use the same color of anti-freeze in the radiator and expansion tank. The Fleet Charge or similar products is just the 50/50 mixture that has already been mixed by the manufacturer. They supposedly use de-ionized water that removes sodium etc. I suppose if you were that concerned you could use distilled water and just mix your own. In all of my diesel farm equipment I try to use clean water i.e. bottled water. I won't use my well water, especially since it goes through a water softener first. I wouldn't get hyper about the issue I'm sure my diesel farm equipment gets a lot heavier use in the farm fields than you would get with a MH on super highways.
I just changed out the expansion tank on my swather. I filled it a couple of times and it was still empty every time I checked it. It had a very small crack and was leaking out at a slow rate. Once it leaks out it evaporates from heat in the engine compartment so it is hard to see the leak. I would also check to make sure the hose to the expansion is not clogged.
For city folks a swather is a 18 ft lawn mower with a diesel engine.
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WyoTraveler
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02/22/12 07:58am |
Class A Motorhomes
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RE: Climbing Grades, Advise Please
Hey Tom,
I have lived in East Tn most of my life and have traveled in the mtns of the west by motor home. I suspect you are equipped just fine for mtn climbing. Your Itasca probably weights just under 30k pounds so witH your tow you are still under 35k. Your C7 Cat is well suited to that weight.
When approaching an up grade, keep your rpms up. If you are facing a fairly long up hill then keep your rpms within a couple of hundred rpms of the rated horsepower rpm. As you climb and the rpms fall keep downshifting to keep your rpms up high in the power band. You can let the Allison shift itself if you wish. It has been my experience that on a fairly steep grade the Allison might not shift quite early enough. If you shift manually the Allison will not let you over rev the engine so don't hesitate to shift. At the top of the hill, if you are faced with a down grade, start down in the same gear you were in when you hit the top. Make sure the exhaust brake is on and keep your foot off the fuel. If the grade is steep and your speed increases until the Allison up shifts, press the service brake firmly enought for about 5-7 seconds to get back into a lower gear and get off the service brake. The goal on a long down grade is to find the gear where the exhaust brake will hold the speed steady a couple of hundred rpm below where an up shift will occur.
You will develop a technique after a few experiences. If you let an up grade sneak up on you, no harm no foul, you are just slower going up. If a serious downgrade sneaks up on you it can be lethal so know what's ahead and pay attention.
This technique will also control engine temps as cooling is best at high rpm. If temps get too high then back off on the fuel and downshift to whatever gear is necessary to maintain a steady speed at less than full throttle. It's unlikely that this will happen but you should make sure your radiator stack is clean before you start your trip as I believe you have a rear radiator.
Have fun & be safe.
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steveownby
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02/20/12 02:10pm |
Class A Motorhomes
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