Dieselguy
Chautauqua County, New York, USA
New Member
Joined: 10/09/2003
View Profile
 Offline
|
I have a 2000 F350 PowerStroke 4X4.
I saw the recent thread that was similar to my problem but a little different. My truck drove as straight as an arrow UNTIL I installed Bilstien shocks on all four corners and put in front add-a-leaf springs. The directions for the shocks said I might need a front end alignment after installation, but I've never heard of that! I also heard that after adding front springs, one might need to adjust the camber? The spring installer said no! Don't they adjust the camber when they do a front end alignment? Doesn't the the camber have something to do with toe-in and toe-out? I'm not sure what to do! All I know is I need to do something!! I can't keep my truck going in a straight line and this all started immediately after the installation of the shocks and springs. I even installed a steering damper thinking this would help but to no avail. My wife is afraid the cops are going to stop me on suspicion of DWI because I'm all over the road. I need help!!!
G. David
|
Larry&Linda
Palatka, Fl
Senior Member
Joined: 02/19/2003
View Profile
|
My brother had the same problem with his 2000 F350 PSD.
An alignment and camber adjustment took care of it and it drives like it used to now.
Larry
|
curt12914
Northern NY State
Senior Member
Joined: 03/15/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
I'm defintely no expert at this, but.......
Isn't camber, the angle the tire touches the road? In other words, a tire doesn't sit perfectly flat on the road. The top is angled slightly in or out. Toe in is the angle of the front tire in respect to the other front tire. They aren't perfectly parallel. The distance from the front edges of the tires is less than the rear edges of the front tires.
If I'm right (and I may be wrong), wouldn't adding a spring change the angle the tire hits the road (what I think camber is)? When you increase the distance (ride height) wouldn't that change the angle?
It's been my experience that when it doesn't drive right, tires wear faster. I'd have the alingnment checked. It's probably cheaper than wearing out a set of tires..
05 Ford F-350 Lariat CC 4X4 PSD DRW Line X Retrax
02 Montana Big Sky 3295 RK (2) Honda EU2000is
When my grown kids were inspecting our new fifth wheel, one asked why we bought a trailer that sleeps 4. My reply was that we couldn't find one that sleeps 2!
|
tempforce
Pacific Wonderland (in the summers)
Senior Member
Joined: 04/26/2002
View Profile
Offline
|
most wheel alignment shops don't do anything but toe in adjustment on solid axles, 4x4 and twin i-beams. take it to a shop that makes adjustments on all three: caster, camber and toe. on twin i-beams it is usually a shop with a frame tool as the beams must be bent. once set up, the alignment will last a long time. compared to other types of front ends.
Charles
From the Coast ranges of Oregon
'08' Dodge mega limo-cab, 409, kelderman rear air ride, max brake controller.
'02' Holiday Rambler TT, the Gypsy Wagon.
'83' Ford Ranger with a 2.2 Diesel, little smoke
'56' F100 project truck
|
BenK
SF BayArea
Senior Member
Joined: 04/18/2002
View Profile
|
Not up on Ford front ends, but since you say "add-a-leaf", assume it's a live axle (aka solid beam pumpkin/tubes with axles inside'm).
Don't know what you were trying to solve with the add-a-leaf, but that could be main cause. Note not only cause, just main contributor.
This kind of behavior is misalignment, worn/loose components, too tight components (this one is my guess) or after market component affecting other components behavior.
Take it to alignment shop specializing in 4x4 with live front axle as others have suggested. Have seen a shop actually have to bend the tubes because the owner didn't want new front live axle...this was against the shop managers advice, but since very good customer, obliged.
The alignment shop should also do health check on the whole front end. Steering components and suspension. Could have worn bushings, loose bolts, worn brackets, worn steering joints, etc.
The shocks could have added to this by stiffening up and giving the whole system HIGHER responsiveness, but if other parts worn, it will dart all over the place. On this, try dropping tire pressure a bit too, but keep high enough to safely carry the load. Higher tire pressure has smaller slip angle, and therefore higher responsiveness.
The Add-a-leaf could contribute because it's made the spring pack less compressable, so anything that used to be soaked up, is now transmitted directly to the steering/suspension system.
Ask if you've after market front anti-sway bar (higher rate) and harder bushings? They would also contribute to cause.
On GM's there is an EVO sensore mounted on the bottom of the steering column. Senses steering angle and tells computer how much or how little power assist. When they go bad (often), computer many times gives too much assist and steering will act just like your description. $28 buck sensor and about 10-15 minute remove/install. Many have fixed with squirt of WD40 (it's a potentiometer and oxided, so this cleans contact surfaces & coats with protective...lasts a while).
On my old 1973 K5 Blazer had similar after putting in Dana 60 front end and fixed with double steering damper (HD from some shock company forgotten name of) and preload kit. Preload kit was bolt on with springs to pull sterring slop out of the game. Had to have it realigned, but solved. This was even with brand new Moog joints.
-Ben Picture of my rig
1996 GMC SLT Suburban 3/4 ton K3500/7.4L/4:1/+150Kmiles orig owner...
1980 Chevy Silverado C10/long bed/"BUILT" 5.7L/3:73/1 ton helper springs/+329Kmiles, bought it from dad...
1998 Mazda B2500 (1/2 ton) pickup, 2nd owner...
Praise Dyno Brake equiped and all have "nose bleed" braking!
Previous trucks/offroaders: 40's Jeep restored in mid 60's / 69 DuneBuggy (approx +1K lb: VW pan/200hpCorvair: eng, cam, dual carb'w velocity stacks'n 18" runners, 4spd transaxle) made myself from ground up / 1970 Toyota FJ40 / 1973 K5 Blazer (2dr Tahoe, 1 ton axles front/rear, +255K miles when sold it)...
Sold the boat (looking for another): Trophy with twin 150's...
51 cylinders in household, what's yours?...
|
|
|
carringb
Corvallis, OR
Senior Member
Joined: 07/28/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
The add a leaf changed your steering geometry. A good aligmnet shop can fix that for you. Depending on how much the add-a-leaf changed the height, and different pitman arm may be needed.
Bryan
2000 Ford E350 DRW Wagon (14-pass all captains chairs)
V10 w/ Banks PowerPack, Diablo Predator, 4.56 LS, 300,000+ miles
Had: Weekend Warrior 41' FSW
|
Dieselguy
Chautauqua County, New York, USA
New Member
Joined: 10/09/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
Quote:The add a leaf changed your steering geometry. A good aligmnet shop can fix that for you. Depending on how much the add-a-leaf changed the height, and different pitman arm may be needed.
Yes indeed, the add-a-leaf raised the front end approx. 1 1/2"-2". On the Ford F350's the frontends always seem to droop some. I was going to install a Boss V-plow and before I added that much extra weight I wanted to raise the frontend to be level with the rear. Now the truck sits level but like you stated I must have changed the steering geomerty. Somehow a different pitman arm sounds very fimiliar but I don't recall in what text in heard it. I think the route to go is a good alignment and possibly the pitman arm. Thank you, to everyone for their help and suggestions.
|
RPFAN
Poughkeepsie NY
Senior Member
Joined: 04/02/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
A good alignment shop CAN adjust the caster and camber without bending anything. There is a cam set that is installed in the ball joint opening giving it an eliptical shape and makes it adjustble. This works really well. I had it done to one of my other trucks, it made it feel like never before. When my Excursion needs it I will not hesitate.
Rich
Rich, Fern, Bethany, Justin. 2005 Ford F450,Lariat, 6.0 PSD,CC,DWR,4WD, Air Hitch, 100 Gallon Aux fuel tank.
2009 Cardinal 3802BH 5 slide, 2 bath
Our "Condo in the Woods"
Leave no roller coaster unridden!
|
mikefrommichigan
Grand Rapids, MI
Senior Member
Joined: 06/09/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
carringb hit the nail on the head. After owning a lifted truck in my younger days, I know from experience the steering geometry has changed.
2003 31' Skyline Nomad Scout bunkhouse (5400# dry weight)
2003 Chevy 2500 Suburban 4x4 8.1L 4:10's Mobil 1 Cooper Discoverer A/T 245/75/R16E
Reese 1200# Straitline, Prodigy brake controller
2003 Giant NRS3 full suspension mountain bike
Wife, child, choc. lab, & feline (cat stays home)
TV & TT Pictures
Reese Straitline Hitch
Nomad Scout 310 Floorplan
Skyline/Nomad website
'03 Giant NRS3
"A bend in the road, is not the end of the road... unless you fail to make the turn."
|
|
