ExRocketScientist
Laurel, MD
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Joined: 11/11/2010
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Chris wrote:FastEagle wrote:Chris wrote:kedanie wrote:Let me see if I understand correctly.
You say that an ST tire needs a 15% reserve and should not be loaded beyond 85% of sidewall capacity. Also, you indicate that the LT tire can be used at 100% of it's sidewall capacity.
If this is true, then a lot of manufacturers of RV's are doing their customers a disservice by putting underrated tires on their vehicles. One that comes to mind is JAYCO that still installs 16" load range "D" ST tires with a 3000# load capacity on rigs with 6K axles. Don't believe me? Go to your nearest dealer and take a look.
Keith
Or most Montana's with GAWR OF 6750 and tires rated to 3420. Do the math 90 full pounds of extra capacity per axle. Chris
The RV show at the Jacksonville, FL Equestrian Center opened today. It was also half price day for seniors so we drove out for a look see.
Here is one that confirms none of the major heavy fiver trailer manufacturer's give a hoot about reserve load capacity in their OE tire selection.
Here is a picture of a vehicle tire placard. It’s self explanatory.
Tire Placard
The nice clean tires were easy to read. Goodyear Marathons
rated at 3420# at 80 psi. Isn’t that just GREAT?
FastEagle
FastEagle how do we get consumers and manufacturers to wake up?
60 minutes seems to gotten Congress attention on insider trading! Anyone know someone on 60 minutes staff.
I can see it now Barry our new buddy on 60 minutes!!! Chris
I see two problems in gaining the attention:
1. RVs are just too small of a minority out of all of the vehicles on the road, and in some people's minds, aren't necessary -- so just don't allow them on the road.
2. I don't know that we can attribute a bunch of deaths to this issue.
But I think that CapriRacer has brought us to a consensus that you really shouldn't be running any tire at its max capacity all of the time. The number one thing we can do in trying to help someone here in replacing tires on these big heavy boxes is to convince them to upsize.
I see a lot of measuring in wheel wells, between tires, and between sidewalls and frames/shocks in our future.
ERS
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Chris
Shelter Bay, Wa
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Joined: 12/19/2000
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RandACampin wrote:CapriRacer wrote:But I will tell you that I see an awful lot of LT tires used in trailer service with failures - and there is one more item that I can't reveal so you'll have to trust me on this - when aI do apples to apples comparisons, I don't see a difference.
Hmmm...very very interesting!
Maybe he is referencing the GY G614! Chris
My Rig
2001.5 2500 STD CAB AUTO SLT 4x4, CTD 4:10's, Bomb'd to Tow
2005 Cardinal 29WBLX.
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just me
Salt Lake City Utah USA
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Joined: 10/30/2003
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CapriRacer thanks for your time and insight. Looks like you have added a lot of explanation and satisfied a lot of controversy that exists here on this forum. And a look at the intricacies of the tire industry.
95 Dodge CC #5 TST plate Flame Red/Silver
not totaly stock
2007 fiver
Tag Ma-haul has been suggested for a name but now The Shoe box
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downtheroad
Pacific Northwest
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Joined: 02/18/2003
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This thread has been fantastic.
Our present rig came with ST load range D tires..
I recently replaced them with Maxxis ST load range E tires...
Based on this discussion I guess I made the right choice. I now have a good margin over the GVWR of our trailer.
(note: it just luck. I ordered LR "D" but Maxxis shipped LR "E". My rims were rated ok for the heavier tire and the dealer did not charge any extra so I took them instead of reordering)
Thanks again CapriRacer
"If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane"
GMC Duramax/Allison (LBZ)
Komfort .... Our Rig Picture>>Click.
Reese Dual Cam HP
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RandACampin
Kathleen, Georgia
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Joined: 04/06/2006
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Chris wrote:RandACampin wrote:CapriRacer wrote:But I will tell you that I see an awful lot of LT tires used in trailer service with failures - and there is one more item that I can't reveal so you'll have to trust me on this - when aI do apples to apples comparisons, I don't see a difference.
Hmmm...very very interesting!
Maybe he is referencing the GY G614! Chris
You would have to ask him (CapriRacer).
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CapriRacer
Somewhere in the US
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Joined: 01/27/2012
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Francesca Knowles wrote:Dear CapriRacer,
As a presumed industry insider, can you explain the difference(es) in
A) Performance between bias-ply and radial (trailer) tires, especially as it relates to rolling resistance?........
Radial tires have lower RR than bias tires. exRS can find that in his 700 page book - it's in there.
Francesca Knowles wrote:.......B) Tread depth/pattern, also as it affects rolling resistance?.......
If we eliminate tire construction as a variable, then you can consider RR to be mostly about:
a) The amount of rubber in the tread. More rubber = worse RR, so lower tread depths = better RR. So a worn tire has better RR than an a new tire. In other words, you should expect a hit in fuel economy when you put on new tires.
b) The composition of the rubber in the tread. There is a HUGE range of values for RR for tires of the same size - on the order of 60% top of bottom. The property is called hysteresis - think of it as internal friction. However, there is still the technology triangle of Treadwear/Traction/ Rolling Resistance to deal with.
It is common for OE manufacturers (and I'm talking car manufacturers here) to specify tires with low RR - and wear and traction are compromised to get it. From time to time, the spec is such that the traction or treadwear is not as good as it should be. This is NOT because of the tire manufacturer - it's because of the OEM's spec.
Sp when you replace your tires on what used to be a new car, expect a hit in fuel economy - especially if you go after better wearing and/or better grip tires.
c) The amount of movement (deflection) the tread rubber experiences. This is mostly about inflation pressure vs load - and I hope I don't have to explain that more load or less inflation pressure results in more rroling resistance.
Francesca Knowles wrote:....Please do differentiate between single- and double- axle trailers if per your understanding any differences exist.
Thanks!
Tires don't care if they are on a single or a double axle or in tandem, or whatever. These kinds of things don't affect how a tire performs - but it might affect how a vehicle performs or how the vehicle forces the tire into certain situations.
* This post was
edited 02/11/12 04:57am by CapriRacer *
********************************************************************
CapriRacer
Visit my web site: www.BarrysTireTech.com
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CapriRacer
Somewhere in the US
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downtheroad wrote:This thread has been fantastic.
Our present rig came with ST load range D tires..
I recently replaced them with Maxxis ST load range E tires...
Based on this discussion I guess I made the right choice. I now have a good margin over the GVWR of our trailer.
(note: it just luck. I ordered LR "D" but Maxxis shipped LR "E". My rims were rated ok for the heavier tire and the dealer did not charge any extra so I took them instead of reordering)
Thanks again CapriRacer
I am hoping you increased the load carrying capacity by increasing the inflation pressure.
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CapriRacer
Somewhere in the US
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Since I now have everyone's attention, I'd like to turn the tables around and ASK a question:
For those folks who experienced a tire failure on their trailer, was there damage to the trailer? What did you do about the damage? Did you file a claim? What did you do about the tire - meaning did you get it replaced under warranty?
I'm asking this question because I want to get an idea of what goes on that I can't know about.
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ausie607
white lake
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Fortunately to date I have not experienced any failures from the Maxxis tires on our Jayco. As I stated earlier I don't know much about tires. I am anal about keeping tires aired up to the sidewall spec. numbers and now I feel reasonably intelligent to calculate the weight, margins etc.
Thanks
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ExRocketScientist
Laurel, MD
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Joined: 11/11/2010
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Fortunately, we blew out the sidewall, so the force of the explosion was away from anything. The biggest problem was some of the tread wrapped around the axle and locked the wheel. You will find three areas of damage for those who have damage (other than some black marks on the side):
1. Blowout of the wheel well and damage to plumbing and wiring on the other side.
2. Destruction of the fender flare.
3. Destruction of the rolled sheet metal body panel at the bottom of the wall.
Some have successfully filed insurance claims with their carrier. Others successfully filed claims with the tire manufacturer. Others didn't file a claim and ate it. What will be interesting is to hear if people filed a claim and it was denied -- and who they filed the claim with.
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